tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post4543822340981403956..comments2023-09-15T08:07:28.542-06:00Comments on Western Hero: God Save the ElephantSilverfiddlehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-54907105399951414502012-11-17T05:59:10.032-07:002012-11-17T05:59:10.032-07:00"A MIND IS A TERRIBLE THING TO LOSE"<b>"A MIND IS A TERRIBLE THING TO LOSE"</b>FreeThinkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16682678301019952436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-83983508822818086052012-11-17T00:14:03.112-07:002012-11-17T00:14:03.112-07:00The elephant is dead, long live the TEA Party.
...The elephant is dead, long live the TEA Party. <br /><br />What you say seems to make sense, but there is such an important connection between social and economic issues that it's almost impossible to sever them (a moral people don't engage in infanticide as birth control any more than they leave their children and grandchildren with inconceivable debt). <br /><br />Where the GOP fails in areas such as the ill-conceived and pretty nutty DOMA. God has already defined marriage, the government does not need to do so. We are ALL so dependent on government, so removed from our unalienable rights that we actually believe government can mandate God's will and word. Silly. Pointless.<br /><br />Government should have nothing to do with religion. At all. Ever. Not legislating leftist OR conservative values and beliefs. Look at that. Let it sink in. Can government really ever legislate values and beliefs? Nope. They don't come from government and can't be granted by nor revoked by government. However, because we know--for a fact--that this administration is dead set on doing just that, we have to fight back . . . for freedom, not religion. <br /><br />[quote]We support the right of all churches and religions to preach their message in the public marketplace of ideas, and we reject all government violations of their religious beliefs. [/quote]<br /><br />This is not needed. Period. We have, already, in our Constitution the right to our "free exercise" of religion. That this has been limited by the Supremes doesn't change that basic fact; we can always go back to them, with new complaints, and challenge those rulings. Unlike God's laws, Congress's laws and the Supreme's rulings are not enduring, nor are they Truth (with a capital "T"). The left knows this far more than conservatives do (that's why they aren't content with one "win"--they need layer upon layer to protect their perfidy).Fuzzy Slippershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13021615731454709413noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-31892040232194468642012-11-16T22:08:33.706-07:002012-11-16T22:08:33.706-07:00Wel you know what they say... the pessimist finds ...Wel you know what they say... the pessimist finds the glass half-empty, the optimist finds the glass half-full, the engineer finds the glass twice as big as it needs to be...(((Thought Criminal)))https://www.blogger.com/profile/17311656184275255223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-87647993045697191512012-11-16T21:37:16.211-07:002012-11-16T21:37:16.211-07:00Yeah isn't it wonderful engineers can travel f...Yeah isn't it wonderful engineers can travel freely about our country.Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-5224163998732181272012-11-16T19:20:26.534-07:002012-11-16T19:20:26.534-07:00I grew in Alabama. Five nuclear power plants... tr...I grew in Alabama. Five nuclear power plants... trains astronauts for space flight... environmentally pristine...<br /><br />Massachussetts just seems kinda backwards to me.(((Thought Criminal)))https://www.blogger.com/profile/17311656184275255223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-88769341681425855652012-11-15T22:54:49.997-07:002012-11-15T22:54:49.997-07:00Obviously you've never lived in Massachusetts,...Obviously you've never lived in Massachusetts, were even conservatives are liberal.Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-2243149382591332292012-11-15T22:27:43.408-07:002012-11-15T22:27:43.408-07:00I dunno Steve. Running the founding father of gay ...I dunno Steve. Running the founding father of gay marriage and pioneer of taxpayer-subsidized abortions as a "severe conservative" was quite a divisive fairy tale. <br /><br />It may well behoove actual conservatives to hear everything these poseurs have to say, catalog it up as an indictment, and purge them from the Republican Party.(((Thought Criminal)))https://www.blogger.com/profile/17311656184275255223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-47040340776313941652012-11-15T21:49:42.693-07:002012-11-15T21:49:42.693-07:00So Teabagger All Star Scott Brown (aka the most le...So Teabagger All Star Scott Brown (aka the most left-wing Republican Senator in recent history) lost his seat for being too far right?<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />(((Thought Criminal)))https://www.blogger.com/profile/17311656184275255223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-90315686869432396662012-11-15T21:14:57.564-07:002012-11-15T21:14:57.564-07:00JMJ: There's no difference between freedom fr...JMJ: There's no difference between freedom from religion and freedom of it. Same thing.<br /><br /> And the way to have both is to stop being fearful of other peoples beliefs. Not every person speaking out of religious convictions is an assault on your liberty, or an attempt to impose a theocracy. They have a right to their world view just as you do, and it's unreasonable to expect them not to be motivated by it. <br /><br /> viburnumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15381796879179539552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-25292675936563448662012-11-15T20:59:52.523-07:002012-11-15T20:59:52.523-07:00While you're SAVING the ELEPHANT, would you pl...While you're SAVING the ELEPHANT, would you please KICK the ASS?<br /><br />Thanks.<br /><br />~ FTFreeThinkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16682678301019952436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-18314172501649549132012-11-15T20:49:52.066-07:002012-11-15T20:49:52.066-07:00Jersey: We're closer than you think on this o...Jersey: We're closer than you think on this one.<br /><br />I don't like the police state Bush set up and Obama continues to preside over.<br /><br />And "kids" do not have the same rights as adults, so I don't know why you mention them along with the 2nd Amendment.<br /><br />And my point about religion is that so long as a practice doesn't violate the constitution, it's no business of the state. Silverfiddlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-57486106687902400362012-11-15T20:06:05.526-07:002012-11-15T20:06:05.526-07:00It's all well and fine to be uncomfortable wit...It's all well and fine to be uncomfortable with abortion. But you shouldn't even be "anti-abortion." Sometimes abortions are necessary medical procedures. People are against drugs, for instance, but you can be damn sure they want some morphine before that back surgery.<br />-<br />On the Fourth Amendment, I notice you use Hentoff, who complains about annoying things, like airport screening and such, and his points are fair, but he seems to have no answer for the question, "Well, then how do we keep psychos off planes?"<br /><br />In a way, it fits your point. Remember, thanks to the Republican reaction to 9/11, the airlines and terminal owners and operators themselves are running a lot of the security, and doing a lousy job of it in some cases. So, yeah, big GOP FAIL there.<br /><br />But all that trifling nonsense aside, if the GOP wants to talk about the Fourth Amendment, perhaps it should start reining in the Police State. Colorado and Washington, a Purple state and a Blue state, both just made it clear they are sick of the war on marijuana, something that far outweighs airport silliness and such when it comes to our rights being violated and the lifelong suffering of multitudes that can and often does come with that.<br /><br />On top of that, we sanction people in all sorts of ways beyond the Fourth Amendment. For example: How does it help anyone to take away a person's drivers license because they owe money for some fine or back child-support payment or because they sold a friend a bag of weed? How does it help anyone to lock these people up? Yet we do that by the thousands every day, not just here and there at this airport or that, but THOUSANDS ALL OVER THE COUNTRY EVERY DAY. Think of the drag on upward mobility, the lost productivity, the wasted opportunities, the welfare money and the penal money? What a waste! What's "conservative" about that? I know a lot of your conservatives agree with me on this.<br /><br />If you're going to be consistent, then look at the Fourth as you do the Second. Any sane person would worry more about the kid selling the gun to the other kid than the kid selling the dime bag to another. And any wise person would know that if you take the illegality of marijuana out of the question, the need for any kid to buy that gun in the first place would be negated.<br /><br />Then there's all this property confiscation... think about that. <br /><br />When you guys start taking the Fourth Amendment seriously, you'll only find friends here on the left.<br />-<br />Your religious concerns are too blurry. I don't know what you're driving at there. We can't simply say, "Hey, whatever crazy religion you believe, you can do anything you want in the name of it without recourse of the people." That sounds insane to me. As with every right, there are limits. You can't punch me in the nose with your religion just as you can't with your fist. You just can't and shouldn't. There's no difference between freedom from religion and freedom of it. Same thing.<br /><br />JMJJersey McJoneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426560061830038806noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-78323881420687237592012-11-15T18:35:25.164-07:002012-11-15T18:35:25.164-07:00I'd still have you arrested, though. No women...I'd still have you arrested, though. No women in her right mind could EVER be suspected of having given you her consent.-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16745768408538827278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-73319936092800539442012-11-15T18:33:03.030-07:002012-11-15T18:33:03.030-07:00I'd make an exception for abortion for rape if...I'd make an exception for abortion for rape if YOU were the rapist, FT. A woman who had spent time with you should qualify for free unquestioned abortions for LIFE.-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16745768408538827278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-71600626442400891192012-11-15T17:39:56.139-07:002012-11-15T17:39:56.139-07:00Wow, Julian Assange, that certainly bolsters your...Wow, Julian Assange, that certainly bolsters your case.Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-65136400284227447552012-11-15T17:32:27.594-07:002012-11-15T17:32:27.594-07:00@FJ No one is ceding any arguments, but you can&#...@FJ No one is ceding any arguments, but you can't persuade people who aren't listening. There are other important issues to address where we probably can make some headway, if we're not being shouted down by single issue voters. viburnumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15381796879179539552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-12269060938420623702012-11-15T16:41:22.056-07:002012-11-15T16:41:22.056-07:00There are legitimate arguments against the "r...There are legitimate arguments against the "rape" exemption, the punishment of the innocent unborn child being but one. I largely oppose it because it will over-criminalize unprotected consensual sex... but don't believe me, just ask Wikileaks founder <a href="http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11949341" rel="nofollow">Julian Asange.</a><br /><br />Don't wear a condom... go to jail.<br /><br />And if a woman can ONLY get an abortion IF she claims to have been "raped", somebody is going to jail if she gets pregnant and doesn't want to deliver the child.<br /><br />And in a day and age when women can already get an abortion for ANY reason... does this make ANY sense at all? What's the crime? Wasting "taxpayer" medical resources (as must be the Swedish case)?-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16745768408538827278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-47401348556768846752012-11-15T16:22:36.875-07:002012-11-15T16:22:36.875-07:00And discussing topic "A" which precludes...<i>And discussing topic "A" which precludes anyone listening to you when you try and discuss the rest of the alphabet is not 'politic'</i><br /><br />You want to cede all arguments to your opposition, that's your choice. Just don't tell me to "follow your lead."-FJ the Dangerous and Extreme MAGA Jewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16745768408538827278noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-54816148460693651042012-11-15T16:12:28.978-07:002012-11-15T16:12:28.978-07:00"There are far too many authoritarian statist...<i>"There are far too many authoritarian statists among us who wish only to advance their social-religious agenda through legislation."</i><br /><br />YUP! And they come both sides of the aisle. Our enemy is neither the DemonRats or the Republicans; it is the all-too-human lust for POWER and CONTROL. Let's face it every person would love to be in a position to call ALL the shots, if he could.<br /><br />It's humanity's greatest failing.<br /><br />Here it is outlined in terse verse:<br /><br /><br /><b>CHOOSE YOUR TYRANT<br /><br /><i>The Democrats want all our money <br />The Chirstocrats tell us whom to call, "Honey." <br /><br />Both factions would have us be slaves <br />From our cradles right on to our graves <br /><br />To a form of ideology <br />That denies our right to be free. <br /><br />Neither a Nannycrat or a Theocrat <br />Can tell ME where to be at <br /><br />And so <br />Each party has become our foe. <br /><br />The lust for power and control <br />Is careening now on a roll. <br /><br />Oh how I yearn<br />To know where I should turn!</i></b><br /><br />~ FreeThinke <br />FreeThinkehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16682678301019952436noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-77975477178594007212012-11-15T11:42:44.606-07:002012-11-15T11:42:44.606-07:00A more important question may be how many Republic...A more important question may be how many Republicans actually advocate and support republican principles?<br /><br />There are far too many authoritarian statists among us who wish only to advance their social-religious agenda through legislation.Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-63269610517275985852012-11-15T11:30:35.880-07:002012-11-15T11:30:35.880-07:00Scrap it? Nah. Just redefine it. Not as a libertar...Scrap it? Nah. Just redefine it. Not as a libertarian gig, because a few of their ideas are somewhat aligned with the left.<br />It needs it's establishment scrapped and/or brought in line with Conservatism.<br />Conservatives come in many shapes. Fiscal, social, constitutional, etc.<br />I have been hoping that the GOP would get more in line with and champion for the Bill of Rights.<br />Most all conservatives do. It's the establishment moderates who want to cave occasionally to the lefts idea of what our nation should be.<br />Thats screwing up election in favor of the left.<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07899335615984185508noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-86290599281587334862012-11-15T11:04:26.790-07:002012-11-15T11:04:26.790-07:00@NOT discussing issues is NOT politics.
No, but m...@NOT discussing issues is NOT politics.<br /><br />No, but making it part of your political platform is. "You want a secular religion,"... no, we want a secular government.<br /><br />C.I sums it up nicely with "We have a GOP that preaches liberty but allows religious tenets to trump it."Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-14508020788599297202012-11-15T10:15:51.604-07:002012-11-15T10:15:51.604-07:00 The new debate is where to place the boundary bet... The new debate is where to place the boundary between sovereignty of the individual and sovereignty of the state.<br /><br />----<br />And when we try to do that here I believe it reveals our better natures.Ducky's herehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14608115001116619877noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-83543513979022731352012-11-15T10:14:40.739-07:002012-11-15T10:14:40.739-07:00FJ: "NOT discussing issues is NOT politics.&q...FJ: "NOT discussing issues is NOT politics."<br /><br /> And discussing topic "A" which precludes anyone listening to you when you try and discuss the rest of the alphabet is not 'politic'.<br /><br /> viburnumhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15381796879179539552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-30164488271673988832012-11-15T10:14:33.901-07:002012-11-15T10:14:33.901-07:00"Does it bother anyone on the left besides Na..."Does it bother anyone on the left besides Nat Hentoff and Glen Greenwald that the 4th Amendment is dead?"<br /><br />----<br />Maybe the most ridiculous bite you've posted in some time.<br /><br />Certainly there is no one on the left (certainly not me (Irony flag is UP)) who objects to stop and frisk or the militarization of cops or the surveillance state or the way #occupy was stomped on (where was the freaking right on that one?).<br /><br />Please stop.Ducky's herehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14608115001116619877noreply@blogger.com