tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post944109804856904467..comments2023-09-15T08:07:28.542-06:00Comments on Western Hero: Abortion is InfanticideSilverfiddlehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-5562923557215094072011-11-28T09:31:19.820-07:002011-11-28T09:31:19.820-07:00The appeal one feels and the affection one gets fr...The appeal one feels and the affection one gets from a zygote are certainly worth every bit of the travail, personal sacrifice and expense it will take to bring it to term in the womb -- of an 11-year-old unwed mother who was dragged into an alley and raped by a gang of hopped up blacks who ground out cigarettes on her body, then pissed all over her after they'd finished slaking their lust.<br /><br />Conceived in sin ...<br /><br />Beautiful, isn't it? <br /><br />Life! Always sacred -- always a blessing -- NOT!!!<br /><br />~ FreeThinkeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-54036118890265075482011-11-16T07:25:47.851-07:002011-11-16T07:25:47.851-07:00Of course you care, because you've actually ha...Of course you care, because you've actually had to kill a person. You actually know what it's like.<br /><br />But how many people who haven't killed a person actually care about innocent civilians being killed in war? I don't see anyone here lamenting the fact that our war in Iraq has inadvertently killed thousands of the civilians we were trying to free.<br /><br />How dare I play the emotion card? You of all people should know that this world is horrifying, and it's filled with human beings that care for little more than their own comfort and safety.<br /><br />With all the horrors the world has seen, you think it's such a stretch for me to say that most people are apathetic to collateral damage? When was the last time anyone here who comments on this blog made a serious outcry for the innocents who've been vaporized by our hands in Iraq and Afghanistan?<br /><br />They don't care because they've never experienced that loss. They have nothing to relate to on that front. But, many here have children, and I'm guessing they love their children very much.<br /><br />Why do you think the term "collateral damage" was invented in the first place?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-57323294050386869522011-11-15T12:41:09.220-07:002011-11-15T12:41:09.220-07:00Jack,
You said:
"And as far as fighting wars...Jack,<br /><br />You said:<br />"And as far as fighting wars, how many innocents did we accidentally slaughter to achieve our goals in Iraq and Afghanistan? My guess is that many of you don't really care."<br /><br />And with that, you throw down the emotion-card. Really, Jack, how could you say such an asinine thing?<br /><br />I believe in "Mission first". I do. I know what it is to watch another human being collapse after a well-placed round from my weapon strikes their flesh. It is ugly. It is not funny. It does not make me feel superior. Many times, after engagements, I would vomit out of fear and repulsion for what I did.<br /><br />In the course of history, in any war or battle, have innocent people been killed? Yes. Yes, they have. No one who I associate with takes that lightly or with apathy. But we do what we do because we do it better than the other guy, and things happen beyond our control. Yet we do care, Jack. We do.<br /><br />Throwing down the emotion-card is bullshit, and you know it. How dare you seek to imply such a thing.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-62024902527943470332011-11-15T11:45:37.857-07:002011-11-15T11:45:37.857-07:00That's because no society has ever done that, ...That's because no society has ever done that, with good reason. I was simply pointing out that justifying killing because of some benefit to society is fairly asinine.<br /><br />I've seen the pictures from abortions. I've already said I think the practice is barbaric. But murder? How can you murder something that isn't even cognizant of its own existence? Flushing out a 2 celled zygote is NOT the same as aborting a baby at, say, 4 months.<br /><br />And, I was trying to point out that it's sort of silly how we try to justify the killing that we're okay with. Killing is killing, and we don't always do it in self-defense. I never said that any killing is morally permissible, just that sometimes it might be legitimate. <br /><br />And as far as fighting wars, how many innocents did we accidentally slaughter to achieve our goals in Iraq and Afghanistan? My guess is that many of you don't really care.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-45407472730895715322011-11-15T11:28:49.398-07:002011-11-15T11:28:49.398-07:00Oh, and Jack:
No society has ever benefited from ...Oh, and Jack:<br /><br />No society has ever benefited from eliminating the unborn to keep its numbers down.<br /><br />Population control is nothing short of womb-based terrorism and fetal cannibalism.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-28508850035293118262011-11-15T11:27:00.643-07:002011-11-15T11:27:00.643-07:00@Jack,
You said:
"Killing someone on the bat...@Jack,<br /><br />You said:<br />"Killing someone on the battlefield is a bit different than aborting a baby or murdering someone defenseless in cold blood."<br /><br />Hmm. Funny, that. I consider abortion to be murdering someone defenseless in cold blood. I mean, how can it be otherwise? Have you ever seen an abortion? Have you had the chance to ask the dead baby how it feels about no longer being alive?<br /><br />Cold blooded murder of the innocent? Yep.<br /><br />As to the "what if the mother doesn't love the baby" issue. Brooke Shields came public in that she had post-partum depression after giving birth. Some women actually kill their newborns during such episodes. Would it have been better to abort the babies before their mothers could kill them post-partum? I mean, if we know the mother won't love them like they should, why not kill them to spare them an awful relationship with, and possible death at the hands of, their mothers?<br /><br />I believe we shall simply disagree, Jack. So it goes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-62150987943757551872011-11-15T07:34:42.813-07:002011-11-15T07:34:42.813-07:00Killing someone on the battlefield is a bit differ...Killing someone on the battlefield is a bit different than aborting a baby or murdering someone defenseless in cold blood.<br /><br />On the battlefield, the idea is that if you don't kill that enemy combatant then he will eventually try to kill you. Whether or not that is morally culpable, I leave that up to you and your conscience. Killing is *never* a good thing. It might be legitimate, and it might even be morally justified in some cases, but taking a human life is never a good thing.<br /><br />Like I said before, I don't think abortion is a good thing in any case. It's probably only morally persmissible in the rape, incest, mother's safety cases, but as an "oops" thing it's likely never morally justified. But should I be the one to determine whether an expectant mother does it?<br /><br />What if the mother just isn't ready, and she bears a child for which she has no love? That happens, btw.<br /><br />If you're going to break it down to society's vested interest, then we can say with 7 billion people on the planet and strained resources, we do have a vested interest in population control. That sounds callous, but I'm trying to argue things on your terms here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-71266708721127494122011-11-15T03:36:29.326-07:002011-11-15T03:36:29.326-07:00Politicians love abortion because it's the gre...Politicians love abortion because it's the greatest circus they can give their electorate.<br /><br />Whomever's in power doesn't seem to have any effect on abortion rates. They're all playing you.<br /><br />Meanwhile, conception really is too early for person-hood. Most people don't care about destroying zygotes, however innocent they are. They can't feel, plan, hope, suffer, think, any of the things that make me care more about a human than I do about a cow. In fact, wouldn't most people care more about the cow? Imagine two charities, one animal welfare, and one for zygote welfare (literally just the zygote, no provision for any later stages of development). Which charity would get more (any) income?jezhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14865247084509280406noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-92092082439250254612011-11-14T18:53:37.014-07:002011-11-14T18:53:37.014-07:00@Finntann,
You said:
"As I do not possess a ...@Finntann,<br /><br />You said:<br />"As I do not possess a uterus I tend to avoid political activism on the subject."<br /><br />Mu sir, this isn't a pap smear we're talking about or genital herpes. You yourself at one time occupied a uterus. I did. We all did. And since it takes two to tango, or you can prove you magically attached yourself to your mother's uteran wall without the benefit of your father's contribution, then you do have the ability to comment openly about activism regarding a womb.<br /><br />Abortion is not a woman's issue, nor is it a man's issue. It is a human issue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-85032491975402751672011-11-14T18:11:04.602-07:002011-11-14T18:11:04.602-07:00FT: In "the right to die" the individual...FT: In "the right to die" the individual is making the decision for themself. In abortion they are making it for another, at least potentially human being.<br /><br />Jack: Do you really want to argue the cow-human equivalency? In 9 mos the cow will still be a cow, the fetus will be a human. The fetus has also not demonstrated that it is a 'risk' to society and its members that the first degree murderer has.<br /><br />The difference between capital punishment and abortion is that society collectively has an interest in eliminating those that are going to kill its members, in abortion there is no collective interest other than possibly financial.<br /><br />I tend to support abortion for rape, incest, and to protect the life of the mother, I can not find moral or ethical support for it as a remedy to "oops".<br /><br />As I tend to avoid using religion as justification for law, I would have to say that my best logical assessment would be that "human" life begins with brain activity. As I do not possess a uterus I tend to avoid political activism on the subject.<br /><br />Cheers!Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-73964916319894860772011-11-14T17:51:04.539-07:002011-11-14T17:51:04.539-07:00Jack: "Murder is the premeditated killing of ...Jack: "Murder is the premeditated killing of another person, not in self defense."<br /><br />I'd have to argue it is social self-defense.<br /><br />Capital punishment is generally reserved not for murder but for the worst sort of murder, first degree murder. <br /><br />In order to be found guilty of first degree murder the government must prove that the person killed with "malice aforethought, characterized by deliberation or premeditation, or occuring during the commission of another serious crime, such as robbery or arson".<br /><br />"To kill with malice aforethought means to kill either deliberately and intentionally or recklessly with extreme disregard for human life."<br /><br />"Premeditation means with planning or deliberation. The amount of time needed for premeditation of a killing depends on the person and the circumstances. It must be long enough, after forming the intent to kill, for the killer to have been fully conscious of the intent and to have considered the killing."<br /><br />Even if it is incidental to the commission of a robbery or other crime, it is done with complete forethought as to the method and possible outcome.<br /><br />And as far as I am aware, there are no states for which the death penalty is a sentence in second degree murder or lesser offenses.<br /><br />Once someone demonstrates that they will disregard our most important laws and violate our most important rights there should be no second chances. Anyone capable of rationalizing it once is capable of rationalizing it twice. <br /><br />I might also add that if a person previously convicted of first degree murder kills again, whether on parole or upon completion of their sentence, liability lies completely at the feet of the state.<br /><br />Honestly, you want vengeance? I'd argue life without the possibility of parole (no really, no parole at all), is better vengeance than execution. Execution is done for the safety of society much the same way you would put down a rabid dog.<br /><br />ECC: "Not every round I fired was done in self-defense.<br /><br />Your thoughts, please."<br /><br />Quit wasting bullets, we have a budget to consider ;)Finntannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234170229108668040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-42814041869577041332011-11-14T17:34:23.813-07:002011-11-14T17:34:23.813-07:00The doctrinaire approach to this sad subject has a...The <i>doctrinaire</i> approach to this sad subject has always struck me as essentially self-righteous. <br /><br /><b>The focus there is much more on <i>condemnation</i> of fellow human beings, who make what-is-deemed a "wrong" decision, -- an excellent excuse for yet another expression of dislike, disapproval and withering contempt -- than on anything resembling affection and genuine concern for the nascent human being involved.</b> <br /><br />Self-righteousness (another term for <i>hubris</i> -- the deadly Sin of Pride run amok) in all probability is responsible for more deprivation, death and destruction than all the abortion clinics on earth put together.<br /><br /><b>No force on earth could be more threatening than the the arrogance of someone who just <i>knows</i> he's right.</b> <br /><br />That said I hasten to add what I should have said above: <b>The deliberate killing of a fully formed fetus nearly ready to be breathe on its own is despicable -- unconscionable -- an atrocity.</b> <br /><br />Nevertheless, the troubling issues of Abortion and the Right to Die have thrown a spanner into the works of American politics. <br /><br /><b>These issues, which in my view should never have been legislated, comprise a gigantic Red Herring that that distracts and deters us from pursuing a proper course towards the restoration of a sound economy, a strong defense, and above all the freedom to pursue happiness in ways we, as individuals choose for ourselves.</b><br /><br />~ FreeThinkeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-80438405243518978162011-11-14T17:01:39.289-07:002011-11-14T17:01:39.289-07:00So Jack, is locking away a criminal immoral becaus...So Jack, is locking away a criminal immoral because you've deprived him of his God-given liberty, and deprived his family of a daddy and a breadwinner?<br /><br />If not, then why is judicial execution OK? Both acts fall under a legal justification, and that is the difference.Silverfiddlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-47793881390696673192011-11-14T16:04:16.955-07:002011-11-14T16:04:16.955-07:00Abortion is murder and like most people here, I be...Abortion is murder and like most people here, I believe it is wrong in every aspect. <br /><br />And I would like to thank God Almighty for saving Divine Theater, she is a true walking miracle.<br /><br />I feel very strongly on this subject because I know that regardless the stage of the pre-born baby, there is life, even it it is the size of a mustard seed. <br /><br />That is a separate individual inside the womb, with their own heart, lungs, eyes, hands, feet and most importantly a soul. No one, including the mother has the right to kill that tiny little person.Trekkie4Everhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03226981394122557804noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-80930348975323394352011-11-14T14:41:36.198-07:002011-11-14T14:41:36.198-07:00AS long as The LORD tells you to kill someone -- o...AS long as The LORD tells you to kill someone -- or wipe out a whole tribe of infidels including their pregnant women, children and elderly bystanders and raze their cities -- it's just hunky dory.<br /><br />If you do it on your own in retaliation for having been brutally assaulted, blackmailed, chronically harassed or to avenge the murder of a loved one, you TOO must DIE.<br /><br />After all, it's The LAW!<br /><br />Ain't it?<br /><br />~ FreeThinkeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-50954876245516463422011-11-14T14:10:54.319-07:002011-11-14T14:10:54.319-07:00Jack,
You said:
"Murder is the premeditated ...Jack,<br /><br />You said:<br />"Murder is the premeditated killing of another person, not in self defense."<br /><br />As a combat Vet myself, I must ask:<br />Since I had it in mind to make sure to kill as many enemy combatants as possible, being premeditated, does this mean I killed them or did I murder them? Not every round I fired was done in self-defense.<br /><br />Your thoughts, please.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-32520768281751146012011-11-14T12:25:18.116-07:002011-11-14T12:25:18.116-07:00Well, I would argue that it fits the legal and mor...Well, I would argue that it fits the legal and moral argument.<br /><br />Murder is the premeditated killing of another person, not in self defense. Whether you're killing someone out of cold blood or vengeance doesn't really make a difference.<br /><br />The moral justification should be fairly easy. It doesn't really matter what someone does to you, killing them when it's not in self defense is murder. You have to plan it, even if the plan is to just roll up on them somewhere and do them in.<br /><br />Camus brought up this very point. What is capital punishment other than state-sanctioned murder? There's no such thing as an eye for an eye. It could be that there are some people who are better off dead, but we never kill anyone out of a sense of mercy. It's always out of a sense of justice and reparation.<br /><br />Just because the law says that capital punishment is okay doesn't make it okay in the moral sense.<br /><br />So if you're going to say that killing a zygote, a 2 celled organism, is infanticide and immoral, then you have to logically conclude that killing any human being when it's not in self-defense is immoral.<br /><br />Mind you, I think both are probably immoral. I find the idea of abortion to be fairly abhorrent at a certain point (if you can see arms and legs it's pretty bad IMO). But we've all got to make decisions every day. You and I, Silver, have helped with the war effort. We participated in activities that were meant to kill other human beings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-49993993627334444272011-11-14T11:51:04.622-07:002011-11-14T11:51:04.622-07:00The Bible does make a distinction between "ki...The Bible does make a distinction between "kill" and "murder." <br />------------------<br /><br />A most excellent point, Silver. They are indeed two distinct actions.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-11132416841877450332011-11-14T11:41:00.235-07:002011-11-14T11:41:00.235-07:00@ Jack: Capital punishment is homicide. Actually,...@ Jack: <i>Capital punishment is homicide. Actually, it fits the criteria of murder.</i><br /><br />Clarify. Do you mean legally or morally? If you mean morally, then you need to provide the basis for your moral judgment. The Bible does make a distinction between "kill" and "murder."Silverfiddlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-3718311146543468002011-11-14T10:58:13.323-07:002011-11-14T10:58:13.323-07:00ecc...and look at our society since that's beg...ecc...and look at our society since that's begun to happen. Imagine the emotional price paid by innocent young kids having sex in hooking up rooms in dorms...our kids are bereft of sweetness and goodness that generations had before them.<br />We've all seen email 'fun' pictures of a whole fraternity of guys standing behind two girls with their blouses up over their breasts. They seem to be 18; imagine how much sex a girl has to have had before she can bear her breasts before a fraternity house of guys? And they don't even seem excited...NO BIG DEAL. It's like they're deadened to really hot, wonderful sex that comes with love.<br />And no, I'm not saying everyone was perfect in the old days; i'm saying there was decency and decorum.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-90683106400778869082011-11-14T08:42:01.832-07:002011-11-14T08:42:01.832-07:00@Jack,
A cow is a "sentient creature"? ...@Jack,<br /><br />A cow is a "sentient creature"? Really? Then perhaps it needs to learn to run faster to avoid being my delicious lunch. Surely if it is aware, it will realize that we eat it, and we should be avoided at all costs.<br />------------------------<br /><br />On an unrelated note to the general readership of this fine blog:<br /><br />I think girls should be allowed to explore their sexuality, and if they do happen to become punished with a pregnancy, they should be able to exercise their rights and abort that pesky nuisance of a baby in their womb. Planned Parenthood is our friend, not or enemy. Without Planned Parenthood, who would guide children in learning to masturbate, exploratory homosexuality, oral sex, transgender issues, and of course, the right to kill the unborn. God bless Planned Parenthood!<br /><br />I want my daughters, and your daughters, to behave like whores and sluts. I want our sons to treat girls like personal sperm donation stations for their pleasure. I want our children to experiment in homosexuality, (hey, it might be for them), and numerous sexual partners. We need to destroy that outdated and out-moded "morality" that the Christians all seek to force down our throats. (no pun intended!) Long live whores and whoremongers! Yay liberalism!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-80793788874385995062011-11-14T07:02:48.830-07:002011-11-14T07:02:48.830-07:00Capital punishment is homicide. Actually, it fits...Capital punishment is homicide. Actually, it fits the criteria of murder.<br /><br />We take life, or are a party to taking life, every day. Any time you eat a juicy steak, you have to remember that an innocent sentient creature was killed for your pleasure.<br /><br />If your friend was lying in a trench with his guts hanging out, begging you to kill him and ease his passing, would you do it?<br /><br />Innocent people get killed from our bombs all the time. Lets talk about the accidental tomahawking of an aspirin factory in Iraq during the Clinton era. Or how about the revenge bombings in Europe during WWII.<br /><br />But that's not homicide, or murder. Those innocent lives are just collateral damage, right?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-4881508782748780942011-11-14T05:50:37.525-07:002011-11-14T05:50:37.525-07:00Jersey, you say "At the moment of conception,...Jersey, you say "At the moment of conception, the fetus has not yet developed. At least get the science right, man."<br /><br />So what's that 'blob' going to be if left to its own devices, an Amana Refrigerator? A Buick?<br /><br />Odd that men have no choice about whether an unmarried woman carrying his child kills it or not, and then has no choice when the mother comes after him for child support if SHE decided to keep the child. how's that work?Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-39568835192998103012011-11-14T05:28:18.804-07:002011-11-14T05:28:18.804-07:00OD357 said...
As a current resident of Mississippi...<i> OD357 said...<br />As a current resident of Mississippi I did vote on this last Tuesday. While the intent was a good ideal, the proposed initiative left too many items out. There was too many potential gray areas. It didn't have provisions for rape or incest. It made in vitro fertilization procedures potentially a crime given failures. It even would have made certain birth control usage criminal offenses.</i><br /><br />I read the same things about this bill and came to the same conclusions. It was flawed from conception. I read a couple of Catholic blogs that determined it's failure to pass to be the end of Western Civilzation. <br /><br />I ......think not.<br /><br />Just a flawed piece of legislation that left too much to government interpretation. We know how well that works out.98ZJUSMChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00835592067007059336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7674333464171899932.post-20867224082014641332011-11-13T21:14:21.683-07:002011-11-13T21:14:21.683-07:00Hey Jersey, why don't you try reading what I&#...Hey Jersey, why don't you try reading what I've written before puking out your ignorant insults?Silverfiddlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13541652236676260219noreply@blogger.com