Thursday, September 6, 2012

Signposts Along Progressivism's Path of Destruction

The Democrat Party is preaching more of the same that got us into this mess...

Events in Europe are revealing the myth of a democratic social society funded by capitalism.  It's untenable. We're in even worse shape here in the US, we just haven't woken up to it yet.

It's a mystery to me why the GOP doesn't point to Detroit or California as object examples of the damage the progressives and their union co-conspirators can do when given enough leeway.  In the case of Detroit, corporate malfeasance abetted by active government policy also contributed greatly to its demise.

California is blessed with wonderful weather, beautiful beaches, great cities, entertainment and technology industries, mountains and outdoor recreational area that are the envy of the world, and bountiful natural resources.  On it's own, it ranks somewhere around the world's 10th largest economy.

Consider what Democrat one party rule has done to that great state...
The state budget, mandated to balance by law, has been billions in the red for ten straight years. Yet Californians re-elect the same politicians, year after year, who produce budgets with multi-billion dollar deficits.
California now has a $16 billion deficit which “assumes” that California voters will pass massive tax increases on themselves. If they do not, the 2013 deficit becomes a mind numbing $20 billion.
Yet despite the red ink, Governor Brown signed into law a “high speed rail” bill that will spend $6 billion on a train between Fresno and Bakersfield – not LA and San Francisco as promised. Polls turned against the choo-choo, but there remain no outcry from California voters. (Robert J. Cristiano)
There's more...
Orchards in the Central Valley were allowed to wither and die resulting in unemployment in the Central Valley as high as 40%. Imagine Californians on food stamps, living in what was the fruit basket of American.
California’s business climate now ranks dead last according to 650 CEOs measured by Chief Executive Magazine. Apple will take 3,600 jobs to its new $280,000,000 facility in Austin Texas – jobs that California would have had in the past. Texas ranked first in the same survey.

California’s unemployment rate is consistently higher than 10% of its work force, and there are few jobs for college students who graduate with as much as $100,000 in student loans. (Robert J. Cristiano)
I don't say this with glee, and neither does the author of the article, who is a California native. He sees California going down the same path as Michigan, which bled out over 70,000 jobs over the past 12 years. Those jobs didn't go overseas; they went to other states.
Jobs, and job creators, are fleeing the state. Intel, Apple, and Google are expanding out of the state. The best and brightest minds are leaving for Texas and North Carolina. The signs are everywhere. Meanwhile, the voters send the same cast of misfits back to Sacramento each year – just as Detroit did before them.
Today, California is following Michigan’s path with exploding pension obligations, a declining tax base, and disastrous leadership. Housing prices have fallen 30 to 60% across the state, evaporating trillions of dollars of equity and wealth. Unemployment remains stubbornly high and under-employment is rife. Do our politicians need any more signs? (Robert J. Cristiano)
Progressive Political Patronage
Governor Brown’s budget will first slash money to schools and raise tuition on its students while leaving all 519 state agencies intact. He apparently will protect political patronage at all costs. (Robert J. Cristiano)
Barack Obama's "Change" will take the entire country down the same path (which I readily admit plenty of Republican progressive have helped blaze as well). We see the shipwrecks broken upon the shoals we are headed towards. Are we smart enough to turn around?


Always On Watch said...

Sizable earthquake in Costa Rica. California next?

Anita Davis said...

Obama is NOT the answer for any freedom loving American. We can not and will not survive 4 more years of him along with the gang of crooks and Progressive Communists that brings with him. Granting Immigration amnesty, is not the answer, and Obama says he’d push for immigration restructuring if he’s re-elected. Drastically reduce our Nuclear Weapons stock pile to satisfy the Russians is not the answer either. You are voting for giving him 4 more years to destroy Capitalism and American way of life. Is that your answer? My God, this guy is a disaster how can anyone in their right mind even think of giving him a second term..
The real question that we need to be thinking about right now is to vote him out
And we will not vote for empty-headed, drug addicted, racist narcissist Nobama-no way-no how. And to that RN guy who insists on promoting Gary Johnson, we are not interested in Gary Johnson so stop posting that crap and go to back to bottom feeding with the rest of those Progressive.
Now zip it and go back to your foggy dreamworld. If Gary Johnson is your only option, then vote for him. You may as well go vote for Obama .

Rational Nation USA said...

The rEpublicans can't because they are as quilty of progressivism as the dEmocrats. They are just less honest about it. History has many examples for inquiring minds.

Anita Davis said...

Oh please Rational Nation USA. Anyway you slice it, your not voting Republican, so why don't you stop spreading your BS and just vote to re-elect the commie and stop trying to kid everybody with your trite remarks.

Just remember If Romney loses, therefor Obama will have another 4 years and we've ALL lost.
This country needs a 180 turn around and fast. Obama can't deliver it even if he wanted to, and he does not..
The status quo must end, and Obama must be replaced. Time to start thinking about it and seriously.

KP said...

I have lived in Cali for over 50 years. Your article is spot on. Last night you got to see Los Angeles mayor Villaregoisa fumble and bumble his way through simple tasks at the Dem convention. If you lived in SoCal you would understand this was expected.

The state assembly is a rigged Ponzi scheme run by the Dems; shocking in the blatant disregard of impending financial doom. The high sped rail is a perfect example. It is a train to nowhere that almost nobody other than the far left wants. The project reminds of me defense spending after appropriations are made. DOD with spend every dime given them (even if it is unnecessary) because they are afraid their programs will be cut if they don't. In the train's case, the Feds offered Cali over $3 billion if they got started. The end cost will be over 90 billion for a line from LA to SF through the central valley.

"It's unfortunate that the majority would rather spend billions of dollars that we don't have for a train to nowhere than keep schools open and harmless from budget cuts," Sen. Tom Harman, R-Huntington Beach, said in a statement.

And speaking of schools: "A new report released Wednesday (Sept 5th) by the state controller's office found that the nation’s largest teacher pension fund (Cali's) has been so lax about detecting pension spiking at California school districts that it is on a pace to audit each district once every 48 years.

The office found that the California State Teachers' Retirement System failed to adequately audit schools districts, missed opportunities to stop unjustified salary increases and failed to use its own electronic systems to stop abuses.

Examples: a 26% pay raise six months before retirement. Missing supporting paperwork from files, etc. This is the same $152,000,000,000 pension system of a union (Cali Teachers Assoc) that essentially runs this state.

To be clear, I am in support of most of the teachers, but their union does not place children first. In fact, practices like those above are evidence of the heads of the union cannibalizing their own as teachers are laid off and schools are failing.

One of the things I really like about the Romney is his push for school choice. To view our failing edicational system you don't have to look any further than Cali.

FreeThinke said...

Anita, Les has a very important point to make. His remarks are anything but "trite." He is aware -- as, apparently, very few of "us" are -- or wish to be -- that BOTH parties effectively conspire against the best interests of the American Public routinely.

BOTH parties are owned and operated by BIG MONEYED INTERESTS who routinely play ALL ENDS against the MIDDLE. These Big Moneyed Interests have effectively rigged the Game, so that THEY can never lose.

They LAUGH to see "us" at each other's throats while their machinations play ALL of us for the fools we are.

I wish with all my heart that Mitt Romney WERE The Antidote we so desperately crave, but he is not. He is just another part of The Oligarchy that has managed with chilling success to keep ANY form of CONSTRUCTIVE, MEANINGFUL CHANGE from EVER taking place.

Rest assured I will vote for Mr. Romney, if only in hope that I won't have to look at Mr. Obama's smug, sickening arrogance and hear this mountebank's halting, droning baritone spout empty rhetoric on the nightly news any longer, BUT I am not expecting any more from Mr. Romney than the out-and-out CRAP we got from George W. Bush and his simpering, out-of-touch Papa.

If you cannot see for yourself that the Bushes, Clinton AND Obama have all been part of the SAME Whole, you are intellectually and perceptually challenged, dear lady.

But don't worry, Les and I are practically ALONE in THIS crowd, so you have LOTS of company to support your Dreamworld Out-of-Date Version of Reality.

And even Les and I do not agree, because I think his support of Gary Johnson in THIS election, however principled it may be, is an exercise in futility.

Sooner or later all of must learn, whether we like it or not, that REALPOLITIK is the ONLY reality.

There is NO ROOM whatsoever for high-minded idealism in the gladiatorial combat that takes place in the Political Coliseum. Just keep in mind that the "gladiators" are out there putting on a great show while literally killing each other solely for the AMUSEMENT the EMPERORS.

That said, if you're being SCREWED, it's probably a good idea to know by WHOM, or don't you agree?

~ FreeThinke

Silverfiddle said...

KP: Thanks for the personal testimony. It really is a shame what is happening in you beautiful state.

Les: I'm kinda siding with Anita Davis here, and here's why: How many Libertarians will be elected to the house and senate this year?

Answer: Zero

So like every other aspect of life, we're stuck with the choices we have. Until Libertarians start the hard work of building the party at the local, county and state level, it all just philosophical talk.

Rational Nation USA said...

Some see the larger picture, some do not. Some carry water, some do not.

I for one as much as I disagree with Obama's policicies see little practicle difference between the two STATIST candidates, both will continue to bankrupt America. Americans will continue to lose liberty under either a Obama or Romney administration. With all due respect Anita it is past time rEpublicans woke up.

Rational Nation USA said...

As I do not wish to be labor the point, I will simply disagree Silver.

And ask... If not now, when?

KP said...

Cali has had an enormous problem with gerrymandering. That is one of the reasons we see such loons in Sacramento. When you only have two members of the same party running for office they compete by promising more and more outlandish and extravagant programs. If you really want to see dirty politics and illegal activity behind closed doors, look no further than local California politics. It is a joke.

Side note: yesterday a study was released that showed San Diego has exactly 100 more Repub registered voters than Dem. It is one of the unique cities in Cali, I assume largely due of the large military prescence and retired military families. The next mayor of San Diego will likely be a gay Republican (Carl DeMaio). Compare that to 90 miles north and the sanctuary city of Los Angeles headed by Villaregoisa .... who real name is Tony Villar. Tony won election in 2009 by a slim majority despite spending 15 times as much as nine relatively unknown challengers.

I nhave predicted this for years now: California is a windown for the future of the rest of the nation. it has been for decades on end. What happens here typically happens nationwide 10 years later. Watch this train wreck. It's coming near you.

FreeThinke said...

Bless you, KP, because you have delivered The Facts neatly and concisely.

Throughout history civilizations have risen declined and fallen -- in endless cycles over millennia. And YET somehow HUMANITY has survived and gone on to found NEW civilizations albeit amidst much misery and deprivation.

The glory of The Golden Age of Pericles in Athens was eclipsed and the world went dark for FIVE HUNDRED YEARS -- and yet here we are today.

"We" are in the process of DYING right now. I feel sorry for our children and even sorrier for our grandchildren, because THEY will bear the brunt of our folly.

HOWEVER, after our decline and fall, though a New Dark Ages will surely come upon us. "The Deadly Yellow Peril" represented now by Communist China and the equally deadly threat of Islamist Expansion are about to have THEIR turn at dominating the globe. I doubt even The Oligarchs will be able to stop THEM, so the world is in for a VERY rough time.

It has been -- and shall be -- ever thus.

We were lucky to have had as much of the good Life as we have had.

"If you have tears, prepare to shed them now," because the mostly glorious period of Western Christian Ascendancy is drawing to a close.

We rejected Jesus Christ once again, and so there is no place to go but DOWN from here on in. I mentioned this yesterday in connection with "What's Wrong with Capitalism?" and was met either with deafening silence, or got trounced with aggressive vociferous criticism based on complete misunderstanding.

I assure you, the situation is quite hopeless.

"The lesson we learn from history is that we learn nothing from history."

Regretfully yours,


Silverfiddle said...

Les: My argument is a practical one. Philosophically, I agree with you.

I'll ask again, how many viable Libertarian candidates are running for national office?

The choice we have is between two marginally different candidates.

Mitt is marginally better. At least with him we have a chance of slowing government growth with him. Reelecting Obama will explode government spending.

However, I still respect your point of view and I also respect your right to vote for Gary Johnson.

Z said...

Our Central Valley in California fed most of America. Because of a tiny fish which flourishes in the Pacific Northwest, they shut the water off to divert it elsewhere or something..I used to remember the grizzly facts, I don't now.

WHat I do remember hearing is a San Francisco Councilman who, at the time, said "I don't know why, but the San Francisco powers-that-be have done all they can to close down that fertile valley for years, and now they accomplished it."

My question is WHY? And there are days I'm a little too scared to want the answer.

Anonymous said...

" Are we smart enough to turn around?"

We are going to find out very soon, my friend. If Obama wins reelection, the abwer is a resounding "NO".

Rational Nation USA said...

KP, Having been born in the Great Pacific Northwest I can remember as a boy of 12 how breathtakingly beautiful I found the entire Pacific coastline. Back when Cali was truly the Golden State. As you so accurately point out corrupt politicians have destroyed what once was.

I am not so sure of the 10 years you mention, the train wreck may arrive sooner than that. Irrespective of which candidate is elected.

On a different note, what are the odds of a guy my age making a go of it as a PFT. As I am going through a transitional period and may need to change career paths I'm thinking outside of the box.

I think there is a need for older PFT's to work with our aging population. 30% or better (and increasing) who are not even close to having any degree of physical fitness.

Fredd said...

I don't know that California can turn things around, with the kind of citizens that elect a socialist like Jerry Brown governor, instead of an entreprenuer like Meg Whitman. They had their shot to turn things around in 2010 but blew it.

As we always hear, people deserve the government they elect.

Joe Conservative said...

Maryland has largely avoided California's fate by substituting gambling revenues for tax revenues. The problem is, there is a likely limit to gambling's revenue growth potential... and so income taxes have begun to go up... but only on those making over $100k years. Result... an exodus to Virginia.

Hack said...

Spot on. Look to Illinois and Cali to see how liberals manage things. It is plain as day.

As far as the two party system argument here...the Republican Party is the only mechanism in place to combat the collectivists. If is far from perfect, but can be changed. Removing Obama is the first step and the only step and self described "freedom lovers" who can't see this plain fact while chiding others to "open your eyes" disgusts me.

Mark Adams said...

FT "These Big Moneyed Interests have effectively rigged the Game, so that THEY can never lose."

Did you copy that from Elizabeth Warren speech last night?

The Political Chic said...

Three times they denied God, and threw him under the bus (so to say)
And they didn’t even try to change the platform until after Republicans jumped on the omissions of God and Jerusalem on Wednesday.!
And nobody can tell me that Obama didn't review the platform before it was presented as saw it. And if he didn't see it, the question becomes, why didn't he see it?. . How come he's so neglectful? LOL.. Like right he didn't see it or he didn't hear Rev Wright's anti-Semitic ans anti American rants for 20 years.

But if you Google this, you'll find that Politico is now reporting that Obama approved of the original, Jerusalem-less, and God-less language less than a fortnight ago. He didn’t try to change the platform until after Republicans jumped on the omissions of God and Jerusalem late Wednesday.... Of course he saw it and HE approved it!
But then again, why should it be a suprise to anyone that a Godless party like the progressives would drop the word GOD? And if you didn't believe it before, it should be very clear to you now.

Jack Whyte said...

No one is able to seek an objective discussion about the city of Detroit without charges of racism from the left. The fact is that thugs control Detroit for the benefit of other thugs, and if one doesn’t happen to be a thug, they are certainly beholden to thugs. California is completely different; it is a bastion of socialists where the popular majority embraces the communist manifesto like a baby clasps a pacifier. What they have in California is perfect for the tens of millions of illegal aliens living there, busily transforming the golden state into a human cesspool not unlike the slums surrounding Mexico City. Perhaps the GOP has simply given up Detroit and California, thinking: let them sleep in their own filth.

Jack Whyte said...

Correction: Change "tens of millions" to "tens of thousands."


Constitutional Insurgent said...

Political Chic - "But then again, why should it be a suprise to anyone that a Godless party like the progressives would drop the word GOD? And if you didn't believe it before, it should be very clear to you now."

That all would make sense if the DNC were running for religious office. If a party cannot make a case for administering the nation without constant invocation of an invisible and unprovable deity, perhaps they don't deserve to win.

BTW, the DNC already had a requisite submission regarding their importance of faith in the DNC platform.

KP said...

@Les << I am not so sure of the 10 years you mention, the train wreck may arrive sooner than that. >>

Agreed, I don't think it matters which party is elected. We are seeing the same thing Europe. It's too late, that ship is sinking.

As for the ten years time to train wreck, John Mauldin wrote a great book titled "Endgame". In it he predicted what we are seeing play out over there. In recent articles in Mauldin's newsletter "Outside The Box" his discusses how the eurozone has avoided the meltdown to date. It is startling that each time at hell's doorstep they do something to kick the can down the road. I think we will see our states and government do the same. My point, Cali has already been doing that for ten years. Now our cities are bankrupted and the state is close behind.

It is a complicated problem here in Cali with plenty of blame to go around. The far left points to the thrid rail of Cali politics; the 1978 initiative called Proposition 13 (officially named the People's Initiative to Limit Property Taxation) which limits property tax to 1% of fully assessed value. The values were retroactively put at 1975 levels and were restricted from rising more than 2% per year. As well, it prohibited reassesment of new value except for change of ownership or in the case of new construction. As well, taxes cannot be raised without a 2/3 majority

The right points to a state that is run by unions and perpetually keeps democrats in charge. Together, the unions and left leaning politicians has created defined pension plans and retirements that are completely unsustainable. They are bargained for in good times and traded for political favor and re-election cash. It is literally a partnership. In Cali, the left's cry "foul" about corporate collusion with republicans is almost foreign to us. This type of relationship is rare in Cali. Instead, we have cap and trade and regulatory hell for big business. Texas is thriving on business driven out of Cali as are other states who are business friendly.

It's hard to imagine a worse situation than the one we have here. We are demonstrating what happens when you drive business out of the state (think over seas). You lower tax revenue but trying to increase tax revenue by raisng the cost to do business. It's all here to see.

As I said on a left leaning blog earlier today, the key is to focus locally. We have to get mayors, like the one coming to San Diego this November, who understand how to fix our cities. This more than state's rights. I am talking about comunity by community correcting themselves by making hard choices.

Truth be told, I don't care if you hang a (D) or an (R) after your name as long as you get the freaking job done. Right?

KP said...

California probably will have to have a statewide election that enables Sacramento to do away with the state constitution and start over. It is that serious.

KP said...

@Les << On a different note, what are the odds of a guy my age making a go of it as a PFT. As I am going through a transitional period and may need to change career paths I'm thinking outside of the box. >>

There is room is the health and fitness field for the aging, both as teachers and as pupils. I work with people ranging from ages 20 something up into their mid sixties and older.

What I find is that men and women in their 60s and 70s don't want to be told they can't do something. They want to work with people who understand their specific issues; aging connective tissues, degenerative changes, slowing metabolisms, etc. They want their drives to succeed and be fit to be respected and recognized. Not poo poo'd.

I am 57 and I am impressed with guys and gals 10 to 20 years older than I doing what was once considered unthinkable in sport and general fitness.

It reinforces my firm medical and political opinion that social security age qualification should be raised to near 70 if a person is able bodied. As well, that union retirement ages should be closer 65. Any person that cannot do this should disability options. AOW's family is a perfect example of why we need appropriate safety nets -- better than they are now. We could take care of those in need if more of us aged responsibly. You want to mobilize people to be healthy? Raise retirement ages. You will see 45 and 50 year olds gettin' bizzy!

Does my body ache? Yes it does, especially if I sit around on my ass twenty pounds over weight.

There are very few medical issues that get better by sitting around. And that includes obesity, arthritis, dementia, hear disease, high blood pressure, herniated discs and vacular problems. This is one of the ginormous changes in medical approaches now to rehab from what they were we when we kids. Today a re-constructed knee is on a passive motion machine day one. Not a cast from your ankle to your hip. It all about move move move move.

Remember, weight lose or leaning out has much less to do with how much you exercise than it does with what we put in our mouths. I am pretty passionate about this.

Shaw Kenawe said...

The Political Chic: "Three times they denied God, and threw him under the bus (so to say)
And they didn’t even try to change the platform until after Republicans jumped on the omissions of God and Jerusalem on Wednesday.!"

What ever shall we do about the omission of God in the Constitution by the Founding Fathers!

Silverfiddle said...

@ Mark Adams: FT "These Big Moneyed Interests have effectively rigged the Game, so that THEY can never lose."

That is a true statement. The problem with liberals like Chief Spouting Bull Elizabeth Warren is that they delude themselves into thinking this is a Republican-only problem when actually it is a bipartisan infestation.

Silverfiddle said...

@ Shaw: What ever shall we do about the omission of God in the Constitution by the Founding Fathers!

Nothing. It is a political document, not a religious or philosophical one.

The founders covered The Creator in the Declaration of Independence.

Ducky's here said...

Well, for all those who want to see the capitalist snake eat its tail a little quicker, Romney's your man.

KP seems to have a grasp on a piece of the puzzle. Romney isn't going to help that.
If anything, Romney will give whatever Budgie Boy is running the state a block grant instead of Medicare funds which will promptly be pissed away on the prison guards union or the cops while the poor lose their health care and become more desperate and the circle widens.

Good luck with him. Or open your eyes. Obama ain't the solution but he can buy time for us to get to a better place.

Silverfiddle said...

@ Ducky: Obama ain't the solution but he can buy time for us to get to a better place.

You're kidding, right?

Ducky's here said...


Ducky's here said...

Political Chic, I'm concerned about the social and economic health of the United States and how we can be a positive force in the world.

The sooner you and the rest of the red heifer crowd but out the better.

Silverfiddle said...

Ducky: Then you're delusional. The only thing Obama is buying us is a greased rail to hell.

Liberalmann said...

Your rants are too Beckian to take seriously. They ramble, take a few facts, lies and distortions along with multiple unrelated drivel and try to make a cogent point.

Silverfiddle said...

Liberalmann: Please break it down for us and provide some specific critical analysis.

Mark Adams said...

SF "That is a true statement." To some, but with Warren bloviating the "rigged the Game" 3 times last night, it sure did remind me of the rhetoric coming from Hitler during his rise of power.

Ducky's here said...

Why, were you there, Mark?

Watch Triumph of the Will. Doesn't look a bit like the Dem convention.

I never saw Warren touch the blood banner once.

Finntann said...

This conversation reminds me of the conversation in the movie Titanic:

Andrews: She can stay afloat with the first four compartments breached, but not five. Not five. As she goes down by the head, the water will spill over the tops of the bulkheads at E deck from one to the next. Back and Back. There's no stopping it.

Ismay: But this ship can't sink!

Andrews: She's made of iron, sir. I assure you she can...and she will. It is a mathematical certainty.

A rather morose thought... now, what were they saying about lifeboats?


Finntann said...

Aw come on SF, give Liberalmann a break... he's a high ranking military officer... General Ities.

Leticia said...

I used to live in California and it breaks my heart that it is now in such financial shambles.

California and Detroit should be used as an example how Democrats tend to run things through the ground. They have allowed and help pave the way for illegals to live there and live off tax payer money and then what's worse the money the do earn goes back to their prospective countries.

It's despicable. And they even had an illegal speak at the DNC?? What the heck?

Shaw Kenawe said...

Leticia: "And they even had an illegal speak at the DNC?? What the heck?"

Benita Veliz was brought to this country as a child, and grew up here. This is the only country she has ever known.

She was her high school's valedictorian, graduating at 16, and she graduated from college at 20.

Tell us what you would have us do with this young woman, Leticia, who, through no fault of her own, has people like you calling her an "illegal," instead of giving her credit for her hard earned accomplishments while having to endure the dehumanizing epithet "illegal" when she had no say in the circumstances that brought her to America.

viburnum said...

@Shaw: She deserves all due credit for her accomplishments, and has no one but her parents to blame for her illegal status. They violated the laws and sovereignty of the United States and put her in the situation.

Shaw Kenawe said...

viburnum, my question to Leticia was What would she have us do with young people like Benita Veliz?

Z said...

SF...I hope you either heard or will be able to hear Cardinal DOlan's asking for blessings on the unborn and praising the sanctity of life at the same convention whose audience cheered for a long time to protect abortion......
it was a stunning prayer, gutsy, and wonderful. z

Ducky's here said...

@Z --- they shut the water off to divert it elsewhere or something.I used to remember the grizzly facts, I don't now.

That's par.

Please shoot me now.

Rational Nation USA said...

Your question Shaw is a compelling one, it deserves thoughtful reflection. Her parent's crime is not hers and she bears no responsibility for it. This must be taken into consideration.

FreeThinke said...


I am a vigorous supporter of The Dream Act.

Ms. Shaw, with whim I often disagree is ABSOLUTELY RIGHT on this particular issue.

In fact I, myself, would go even farther and say we MUST confer citizenship on the mothers and fathers of innocent children born in this country as well.

Since no one in power seems to have either the GUTS -- or the physical ABILITY -- to SEAL the BORDER, we have no proper moral choice but to ACCEPT the vital, energetic, mostly helpful presence of these people and CONFER citizenship on them.

If you are in fact a decent, Christian human being, how COULD you possibly even CONSIDER separating children from their parents and vice versa?

What kind of moral DEMENTIA would cause any of you to think it right to send innocent children, who are in fact "natural-born American citizens" to live in the HELL of a Turd World Country just because their poor, likely DESPERATE parents came here seeking a better life?

If you want to solve the problem of No Good BUMS and THUGS coming here just to TAKE ADVANTAGE, there is only ONE thing to do:

TURN OFF the friggin WELFARE TAPS that attracted these rotten elements in the first place.

That would AUTOMATICALLY separate the wheat from he chaff.

It's the WELFARE, Stupido!

~ FreeThinke

Mark Adams said...

Ducky "Why, were you there, Mark?...I never saw Warren touch the blood banner once."
Was I there, no. And I never "saw" her touch it either.

However what I did 'hear' was her using the same rhetoric Hitler used, 3 times to rally the mass against others. That the system was and is "rigged" against 'them', as Hitler accused the Jew of doing against the citizens of Germany and their despair.

Ducky's here said...

I see, Mark. Someone uses a populist tone and it's Hitlerian.

Please stop.

viburnum said...

Shaw: "viburnum, my question to Leticia was What would she have us do with young people like Benita Veliz?"

Well if you're seconding that question to me, I'll tell you that I've already written my representatives in Congress urging them to take up the issue, give it that careful consideration that Les mentions, and grant relief to these innocent victims of their parents criminality. That is all that you or I or for that matter Barack Obama have any right to do. If an exception to the law is required, it is strictly the province of Congress to grant it. Any other solution violates the Constitution and sets a dangerous precedent for the future.

Mark Adams said...

"populist tone" LOL! Sure, whatever ya think, Ducky....

Teresa said...

I'll grant that Republicans need to be reformed but they sure are a lot better than Democrats. Any person who can't see that must be looking through cloudy eyes with misconceptions of reality. Not voting or voting for a third party candidate is a vote against America. I am so sick of these purist libertarians. They are living in a utopian fantasy land while they need to work within the confines of reality.

Constitutional Insurgent said...

If it's any consolation......Libertarians are sick of people voting for the status quo and thinking they're going to get change.

A vote against your a wasted vote.

Teresa said...

The "conscience vote" is like Catholics who claim to vote for Democrats because they believe their for the poor while the person is pro-abortion all the while ignoring abortion which is not a matter of prudential judgment.

I hope people can live with their "conscience votes" when America goes down the gutter and follows the path of failed countries. The Founding Fathers would really be proud of you for throwing away a good country which they shed blood for us to enjoy certain freedoms because the federalists and anti-federalists surely didn't compromise when writing the Constitution.

Constitutional Insurgent said...

@Theresa - I'm very comfortable with my vote. Because although you write that the Founders didn't compromise when writing the Constitution [which ignores the compromise of slavery] would have me, or those like me, compromise our principles merely to vote for the GOP.

The Democrats didn't bring this nation down the road it's on by themselves. They had the willing complicity of the GOP.

Teresa said...

@Constitutional Insurgent

Are you implying that once a person/party is apart of the problem they can never change and become apart of the solution? Especially with different players at hand?

GOP screwed every time they compromised with progressives or instituted progressive policies. When they stuck to conservative principles the GOP was fine.

So you would rather not vote and have our country led to tyranny at a fast pace rather than vote to reverse course save America and get this country's fiscal house in order at a slow pace? How can one who votes "based on conscience" or "doesn't vote based on conscience" allow the country to head further in the wrong direction and continue to be in a state of decline justify their this based on rational thought?

Constitutional Insurgent said...

@Theresa - "Are you implying that once a person/party is apart of the problem they can never change and become apart of the solution?"

Not at all, but the GOPs track record has been abysmal during a large part of my voting lifetime. I still hold out hope that the right can find it's Conservative roots...but we may differ on a few tenets of what constitutes Conservatism. The left is a lost cause and a dead

end...but until and/or unless the GOP governs like Conservatives in regards to the economy and individual liberty...they are no better than the Democrats.

"How can one who votes "based on conscience" or "doesn't vote based on conscience" allow the country to head further in the wrong direction and continue to be in a state of decline justify their this based on rational thought?"

I always vote...and always on conscience. One mustn't comprise....right?

You determine the Democrats to be heralding tyranny...I don't subscribe to such apocalyptic hyperbole. While you see Romney as "better than", I see him as "as bad as".